Macmillan Holdings, LLC. Grammar Girl, Grammar Girl's, QDnow, and Quick and Dirty Tips are all trademarks of Macmillan Holdings, LLC. What the inauguration can teach us about verbs. Tom grammar I noticed you used the phrase "exactly the same" when talking about verb splitting. Redundant? http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=19429#Comments http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=19429#Comments Fri, 25 Sep 2009 15:01:33 GMT Gregg on Lorraine Blvd. grammar John from Lorain doesn't seem to understand that language is a living entity and as such changes over time. The miracle of language is its inherent creativity, and our interaction with language creates our reality. It's obvious that reality changes, so it makes sense that "rules" of language also change. We've all noticed that literature changes throughout history, just look at the changes during the second half of the 20th century. To ask "why" a rule exists is of the highest displays of "respect" for a language--I don't know who John's neighbors are so I can't comment on that. To know why a rule exists brings us closer to language and thereby increases our understanding of it; increases our appreciation (and respect) for it. To respect language we must acknowledge that it changes whether we like it or not. If we become too attached to the mechanics of language at a particular point in time we'll miss its aliveness. It's like dissecting a bird to understand how it flies. We learn a lot of things but the bird no longer flies. To end our understanding there "is truly barbaric." Grammar is not a method of autopsy, it's an illumination. http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=16542#Comments http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=16542#Comments Thu, 16 Apr 2009 22:54:00 GMT RAcc grammar To John from Lorain "Rpmason does not have the right to invent a rule (such as the one quoted) and to impose it on the English-speaking world. The rule that rpmason opposes is a valid one, and I will follow it." But you, JfL, have the right to insist that people use the rules YOU like, refusing to recognize that there are a number of respected linguists and grammarians who make a case in favor of splitting an infinitive. Would you argue with H.W. Fowler regarding his division of people into classes: (1) those who neither know nor care what a split infinitive is; (2) those who do not know, but care very much; (3) those who know and condemn; (4) those who know and approve; and (5) those who know and distinguish. You seem to prefer living in category 3, which is your right. But it doesn’t mean that your strict adherence to rules is the only way to be correct in this matter. And you may find it enlightening (or maddening, I suppose) to read the section on split infinitives in Garner’s Modern American Usage. And, finally, to address your comments: “As soon as he tried to speak off the cuff, however, he usually hemmed, hawed, fumbled, and made a mess of things. Being the "media darling," however, his gaffes (and those of his running mate) were hidden from the public as much as possible. His political "handlers," realizing the candidate's lack of mental agility when "off script" and his inability to speak spontaneously without gaffes, made sure that such occasions were kept to a minimum. Since taking the oath of office, he has already refused to answer a question posed by a friendly member of the press corps. We are in for a long four years (in, oh, so many ways) Oh, yes. And Bush was such a fine off-the-cuff speaker. I’ll wait for the first volume of Obamaisms. http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15757#Comments http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15757#Comments Mon, 16 Feb 2009 02:35:57 GMT rpmason grammar I'm not sure how to avoid awkwardness and write "flatly to state". Splitting the infinitive allows the adverb to directly modify the verb within the infinitive. Or should I write ...to modify the verb directly within the infinitive? Um, no. http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15544#Comments http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15544#Comments Fri, 30 Jan 2009 18:14:16 GMT Jerry from NY grammar It seems, John from LORAIN, you are merely following the rule because it is a rule, but for no other reason. The evolution of grammar is intrinsic. Just as the rule of avoiding prepositions at the end of a sentence is slowly going the way of the buffalo, so will, I venture to say, the rule of avoiding split infinitives. It is not a "barbarism" for language to change. It is the natural way of things. Blindly following antique rules is just as ignorant as you say I am. http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15543#Comments http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15543#Comments Fri, 30 Jan 2009 16:52:59 GMT John from Lorain grammar From rpmason: "In a language where the infinitive is made up of two words, like English, it can be split." Rpmason does not have the right to invent a rule (such as the one quoted) and to impose it on the English-speaking world. The rule that rpmason opposes is a valid one, and I will follow it. I also disagree with his/her comment about the position of "flatly," which can be before [usually the better choice] or after the infinitive -- and without losing the desired connotation. PS: The fact that rpmason considers at least one airport security rule to be "inane" further helps us to realize that he/she is having trouble thinking clearly and evaluating things. http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15542#Comments http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15542#Comments Fri, 30 Jan 2009 13:13:23 GMT rpmason grammar "...no 'rule is inane.'" I went through US airport security several times during the past week. I am thankful for slip-on shoes. http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15536#Comments http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15536#Comments Thu, 29 Jan 2009 18:16:04 GMT rpmason grammar I stand by my wording. In a language where the infinitive is made up of two words, like English, it can be split. In a language where the infinitive is made up of a single word, like Latin and some other languages, it obviously cannot be split. Sometimes the adverb within the infinitive provides a clearer meaning or avoids an awkward construction. For example, 'to flatly state' and 'to state flatly' have completely different meanings. http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15535#Comments http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15535#Comments Thu, 29 Jan 2009 17:14:06 GMT John from Lorain grammar John B writes (speaking of me): "To congratulate John Roberts for rearranging the words of a constitutional oath because they offended his sensibilities is the height of arrogance." I did no such "congratulat[ing]." For John B to misquote me "is the height of" injustice. Written by rpmason: "I'm generally in the prescriptive camp but this rule is inane." This too is an improper comment, because no "rule is inane." The word, "inane," means, "lacking in sense or substance." A rule never would have become a rule if it lacked sense or substance. The fact that various people desire to disobey a rule cannot cause the rule suddenly to lack sense or substance. (I will resist the temptation to say that a violator of a rule lacks sense and substance!) http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15533#Comments http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15533#Comments Thu, 29 Jan 2009 16:03:19 GMT rpmason grammar I left town for a week and came back to find this dead horse was beaten--again. Let's bury the poor thing so the worms can eat what is left. Too many people follow rules blindly without applying brainpower. Aside: I'm generally in the prescriptive camp but this rule is inane. http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15531#Comments http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx?commentid=15531#Comments Thu, 29 Jan 2009 15:28:17 GMT Fri, 25 Sep 2009 15:01:33 GMT http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/splitting-verbs.aspx feedback@quickanddirtytips.com (Managing Editor) feedback@quickanddirtytips.com (Webmaster) en-us